S5 E10: Why Business Owners Need to Take REAL Time Off with Louise Oliver of Peritus PR

Adrian McIntyre: 00:00:01

From the Public Relations Global Network, this is PRGN Presents. I'm Adrian McIntyre.

Abbie Fink: 00:00:07

And I'm Abbie Fink, president of HMA Public Relations in Phoenix, Arizona and a founding member of PRGN. With public relations leaders embedded into the fabric of the communities we serve, clients hire our agencies for the local knowledge, expertise and connections in markets spanning six continents across the world.

Adrian McIntyre: 00:00:28

Our guests on this bi-weekly podcast series are all members of the Public Relations Global Network. They will discuss such topics as workplace culture, creative compensation and succession planning, the importance of sustainability and environmental, social and governance programs, crisis communications and outside of the box thinking for growing your business.

Abbie Fink: 00:00:47

For more information about PRGN and our members, please visit prgn.com. And now let's meet our guest for this episode.

Louise Oliver: 00:00:59

Hi, I'm Louise Oliver, president and founder of Peritus PR. We're an Alabama-based communications firm that's known when the stakes are high and our clients need the clarity to make decisions. Our firm has found over the years that leading is hard and change can feel overwhelming, and we're brought to the table when our clients can't afford to get it wrong. And I'm so fortunate every day to work with communicators that I think are working towards something bigger than a paycheck that really are motivated by Peritus's mission to make Alabama a better place to live and to use our gifts to make a difference.

Louise Oliver: 00:01:58

My side hustle is I am a mother of three kids under four, so all cocktails are welcome at the Oliver House past five. But yeah, just, you know, doing my part to make a difference and try to create a culture in agency life that transcends beyond the traditional burnout culture and to try to make this a place that can live well beyond me. So happy to be here today and talk all things maternity leave.

Abbie Fink: 00:02:36

I'm very excited about this conversation and something you said in your introduction about, you know, leadership is hard, leading an organization is hard. As PR practitioners and counselors, we provide that kind of conversation to our clients and we're regularly having these discussions about leadership and internal communication and how to share vision with your team. And sometimes we forget that we are also leading organizations and have to share that vision and put trust and empowerment into our teams.

Abbie Fink: 00:03:17

You are returning recently from a maternity leave and really had to say, “Hmm, what am I going to do as I need to step away and manage my home life and allow this agency to continue.” And I'm so excited when you brought that up as a possible conversation for this podcast because I think it's so important to remind ourselves that we do have multiple roles that we play, and we also have to some extent practice what we preach.

Abbie Fink: 00:03:51

So let's talk a little bit about that internal struggle that business owners have about giving themselves the opportunity, whether it's maternity leave or a two week vacation, to step away and say you have to do this not only for the benefit of yourself, but it really does benefit our organizations as well.

Louise Oliver: 00:04:13

Yeah, Abbie, that's a great point. I think the struggle is real, if any business owner is getting real. And I think we talk a really big game and we believe it. And giving those folks that choose to work for us, we want them to go enjoy that leave and that time off. We think it's so important for their ability to reflect, recharge, come back ready to tackle work. But we're really, most of us are really bad at doing that ourselves.

Louise Oliver: 00:04:52

We take days off, of course, we take a trip here and there. But I think if you polled most business owners, many would likely say, “Of course I've taken a leave.” But I think it's a leave with air quotes, right? They're still scanning emails, checking in. They're there to help if something blows up. And I've personally experienced two maternity leaves like that, where it felt like this is just kind of the price I'm going to have to pay as a business owner.

Louise Oliver: 00:05:30

Like, "Covid hit, Louise. Suck it up." You're going to have to have a leave-ish. Or a key staffer leaves close to the time my second child was born where I felt compelled to stay accessible. So I think it's hard for a lot of us to imagine what a truly, I'm talking true disconnected leave looks like. And that's not a bad thing. There are a million reasons why it's important to say somewhat accessible, right?

Louise Oliver: 00:06:10

Top client, you have a small team, potential revenue issues. You're worried a little bit about quality control. There are a million good reasons why. But once I drank the Kool Aid and actually experienced my first leave, I realized that I feel like this is something we should be talking about more as business owners. And you said this, Abbie, I don't think a leave always has to be parental, right? A sabbatical, even if it's necessary. Time off for a sick family member. Time to travel or just needing deeper space to pursue a side hustle where that whisper is getting louder.

Louise Oliver: 00:07:06

I think that time away for clarity and a balance of course is essential for you, but also I think, showcasing that you're willing to walk the talk on taking leaves because I believe after experiencing a real one that they truly can be transformational for someone and for their company.

Abbie Fink: 00:07:35

I see this as to some extent there's maybe a three-step process, or maybe more. You've got the leave itself, and in the scenario of paternal leave, you ideally know the parameters around when that is going to happen, all things considered, when you're going to leave and when you expect to return. So you have some time in advance and when you come back. But it's really to me about recognizing what you need to do yourself to be ready to mentally check out and be able to do that, but equally to prepare all of those, you know, have answers for all of those excuses.

Abbie Fink: 00:08:21

If it is a top client that needs your attention, how do you ensure that they know they're getting attention? If it is revenue based, how do you ensure that those things are going to continue? So there's a lot of pre-planning that has to go into that and trust, no matter what the size of your team is, that they can and will step up because you've given them the tools and trust they need in order to fulfill that. And you know, it doesn't always have to be the leader, but the other is not in their presence. So talk a little bit about some of those tried and true lessons from your first two leaves versus the third and what you did to prep and plan to be able to walk away comfortably for that extended period of time, knowing that things were going to continue maybe differently, but were going to continue without your daily presence.

Louise Oliver: 00:09:22

Yeah, you're so right, Abbie. Part of why you're a business owner and you're successful is the grit part. We're good at the work side, right? Like, give me a checklist and a few all-nighters and I can prepare for the tactical side of a leave and make sure I've crossed my T's, I've dotted my I's, I've got folks feeling good and comfortable. But I think for most business owners or people in positions of leadership power, it's more of the mental side where you have to be stronger than you likely are giving yourself credit for. So before my leave, I think our firm, this is kind of funny. We're a team of, we're under 15, right?

Louise Oliver: 00:10:18

I think I was the fourth out of six extended leaves back-to-back on a team of 15. So that's more than a third of our workforce. And gosh, Abbie, our team was tired. You could see it in their eyes, right? They have been backing each other up, covering for one another. That culture at Peritus of taking care of your own, which is at a lot of agencies, right? So like every business owner, I figured I would do the usual type of leave, right?

Louise Oliver: 00:10:51

Busted. As much as I can to enjoy my leave as much as possible, but I'm still there if you need me. Because we've got to be the hero, right? As many of us agency owners are addicted to that side of our personality. But a few weeks before my third child's birth, I was sat down by Peritus's team of mentors and they said, “Louise, do you really want to see this firm take off into a next chapter of growth?”

Louise Oliver: 00:11:27

Absolutely. I'm hoping to use my leave to start thinking through that and get prepared. And they said, “Well, the best way you can do it is to completely, completely walk away, completely cut off.” And Abbie, do you know what my reaction was? I just burst into tears.

Abbie Fink: 00:11:51

I can only imagine. “What are you people crazy?”

Louise Oliver: 00:11:55

Right? It was like, “How dare you?” My ego was flaring. How could the firm survive without me? Or the hero side, right? I can't do that to my team. They've been through all these other leaves. This is part of the rite of passage, right? As a business owner, you get to take a watered-down leave. And thank God for our agency consultant. It's Agency Management Institute owner Drew McLellan. He can be very a matter of fact, which I need sometimes in my life. And he looked at me and said, "Louise, with all due respect, you're not as important as you think you are. Of course, do this for you and your family. But more importantly, show your team you trust them, and give them this experience of leveling up.” And once I realized that the greatest gift I could give my team was to truly get out of the way and trust them to evolve this firm better than I left it, I never looked back. And when I say I completely cut off email for three months, I'm not exaggerating.

Louise Oliver: 00:13:15

And as you hinted at, I think my first lesson is like, it felt like mourning the loss of your first child. Like sick or something. Moving beyond the guilt of walking away took time, but weeks later, I started feeling energized. And then that turned into feeling inspired. And for the first time really ever, the noise went away and I could truly picture where I could take Peritus.

Louise Oliver: 00:13:57

And I'm sure you agree with this, Abbie, but why does it take a child entering this world—and in my case, an intervention—to have someone really think about how to step away and slow down in order to speed up? That really was where my journey began, with thinking through, why aren't more business owners doing this? And more importantly, why aren't they talking about it? Whether they're having trouble doing it or they're crushing it, and they do it every year and they're spreading the gospel. I felt like, you know, even going to conferences with my colleagues, most hadn't ever done it, or if they had, they certainly weren't talking to me about it.

Abbie Fink: 00:14:53

Well, you know, so much of our self-worth, I think, is built into what we do. The first thing you say to somebody when you meet them is, well, what do you do for a living? And, you know, those types. I mean, that's it. Just part and parcel of how we describe who we are. And we take great pride in that. And the busy, “oh, I'm so busy, I'm so busy,” is a sense of pride.

Abbie Fink: 00:15:22

And I think maybe these last handful of years have really given all of us an opportunity to look differently at what does that mean anymore? And can we be busy and have pride in the work that we're doing without it completely dominating 24/7? But the thing that strikes me in this conversation is really about what Drew said to you, the impact that that had on your team, and giving them opportunity to really learn what they were capable of doing in a way.

Abbie Fink: 00:16:03

Not that you would have ever discouraged growth or opportunity to advance, but they stepped into their abilities because they had to, and they were given the opportunity to make decisions. And my expectation is, you know, gave them permission to do this their way because you weren't going to be there to yes or no those ideas and those processes. So I'd like to hear about that conversation that happened with your senior leadership and then ultimately how that transferred to all of the partners that you work with, the clients and the others that are involved, that said, “Louise is stepping away for this period of time, but our team is still your team. And internally we are still Peritus, and here's how we move forward.”

Louise Oliver: 00:17:00

Yes, it was such a game changer, really, starting with the mindset. Because as business owners, a year goes by while we get into a habit. The year becomes a decade, right? Where all of a sudden our hands are in all these decisions in conversations. And of course, I'm always on X call with X high stake client, and we assume that we're that glue. And this is a funny story. We had evaluations as a team right before this leave happened.

Louise Oliver: 00:17:38

And something that bubbled up on our team evaluations was a message from our staff, very loud and clear. Like, “we know our leadership team is united, but we're not really seeing that visibly. There feels like there's just a lot of siloed, everyone kind of dividing and conquering and on their own islands.” And that almost. Abbie, if I'm real talking here, I was like, “well now I definitely can't step away,” right? There's this perception of a lack of a united front, for lack of a better term.

Louise Oliver: 00:18:20

And of course, as everything that came out of this leave, it totally gave my leadership team a chance to level up. And what I realized I had unknowingly been doing was serving as this glue, holding our leadership team together in certain ways. But I was robbing our leaders of an opportunity to lean on each other, to gain deeper respect for each other's opinion. For me to not be the first person to speak up or, oh, let me go debrief with this person and make sure we're all on the same page.

Louise Oliver: 00:19:02

It forced them to all figure out ways to utilize one another's strength without me as the center of that DNA. And I realized that I had been robbing them of an opportunity to forge their own bond and trust one another in the trenches. And it was so funny. Even coming back, I would get on leadership calls, and normally I was that central voice, unifying the meetings. It got to the point where I was trying to find my voice in providing an opinion again. And they were in their own rhythm and personality dynamics to the point where I was quiet most of the call—in a good way quiet, right? Like, “Y’all’s collaboration here, if I get in the middle, I'm just going to mess things up.” And that's a really cool thing to see that I did not expect. Of course you think people are going to level up and get new responsibilities, but seeing that level of collaboration and trust in one another without me at the center, again, just total game changer for the firm.

Abbie Fink: 00:20:33

Well, and that leads to my next question. Now that that's happened and you're back, how did you, you know, how did reentry happen and how did you come back into the company that had really moved forward in a positive way and come put yourself back into the fold without taking away what has just transpired, and leading from this new place with this new philosophy. So how do you reengage with your team in a way that honors what just happened, progresses it forward and gives you this inspiration and re energy that you've created for yourself, Put that into play now into the business or anyone that's getting to this place where they are coming back from that time away to put that action into, you know, second phase of action.

Louise Oliver: 00:21:41

Yeah. I think you have to almost awkwardly return and feel more irrelevant. You got to expect it, lean into that discomfort and use that space and that extra time to focus on the things that only you can do well or that are a real reflection of your unique “it” factors that likely have helped the firm get where it is but that, gosh, if you only have five more hours a week, you would love to be spending on those. And I remember the first week back realizing that the teammate that was taking over more of the day-to-day operations for the firm had so come into their own while I was out. And it was really refreshing to see.

Louise Oliver: 00:22:39

But I almost had anxiety about, well, the guilt, like, what do I do with this extra time I have? And Abbie, I have had on my to-do lists for years—I'm a huge reader—to take around to where I live, to several just movers and shakers and trailblazers that live in my area, a book that reminded me of them. And again, always on the bottom of the to-do list. There's never time for that. I sat down and wrote each of them a handwritten letter and hand delivered, no agenda attached. Just like, “You're awesome. I love what you're doing with this. I thought this book would inspire you.”

Louise Oliver: 00:23:26

Abbie, I think I got three meetings, like legit “Louise, thank you so much for that. I would love you to come in and let's talk shop about blank,” right? And so you have to trust yourself enough to take that step back. And I remember a big takeaway I had when deciding whether to fully disconnect. And you know this, Abbie. No one's ever going to know if you're checking in, right? Like you can scan the old email. No one would know, right? There's not some security camera watching you, reporting that to the team. And you almost have to think about it as, can you look yourself in the mirror and ask, can I truly let go? Because that temptation to check in is always there, right? But I think about, and you know this through PRGN, how many business owners out there try to retire or sell part of their company only to realize, hashtag, I've got control issues. They can't let go for whatever reason. We all have that a little bit in us, so you almost have to learn to trust yourself bigger than, yes, trusting your team, but trusting and proving to yourself that you can step into a new era of leadership, no matter how small or big your team size is, no matter how large your leadership team is, you have an opportunity through every leave situation to not only level up your team, but move closer into the role that you were made perfectly to do. So those have been, I think, really helpful moments for me in embracing that feeling of irrelevance and learning that I have the ability to trust myself to truly disconnect for the first time ever.

Adrian McIntyre: 00:25:41

Thanks for listening to this episode of PRGN Presents, brought to you by the Public Relations Global Network.

Abbie Fink: 00:25:47

We publish new episodes every other week, so subscribe now in your favorite podcast app. Episodes are also available on our website, along with more information about PRGN and our members, at prgn.com.